Creationist Lawyers, Defenders of Evolution?

I recently crossed swords on X with whoever (is that you Casey?) runs the Intelligent Design The Future account, a mouthpiece, pun intended, of the Discovery Institute’s Center for Science and Culture, over the spectacle of Lawyers pontificating on scientific subjects.

Here’s how it went:

IDF: In this new interview, an attorney evaluates the evidential strength of the arguments for intelligent design.

Me: Why not ask an electrician or an office manager? Lawyers don’t have any training, as lawyers, in evaluating scientific issues.

IDF: You miss the point of connection. Lawyers don’t need to be trained specifically in scientific matters in order to apply their training in evaluating evidence for scientific claims. In addition, they also have skill in making complex ideas easier to understand.

Me: No, I understand the rhetorical point you’re trying to make, I simply reject it as being merely that, rhetoric. Lawyers are advocates who operate under very different rules than those of scientists. I could go on but I think Genie Scott did a better job than I could in a piece she wrote in 1993 in response to similar arguments made by Phillip Johnson in his book Darwin on Trial (1991) and I would direct those who are interested to read that: Darwin Prosecuted: Review of Johnson’s Darwin on Trial by Eugenie Scott

This little exchange got me thinking.

Creationist lawyers like to style themselves as noble truth-seeking prosecutors working tirelessly to indict the perfidious theory of evolution (or Charles Darwin etc.), for being fraudulent and leading the innocent astray.

But that’s not what they are.

They’re not prosecutors at all. They’re defense attorneys —and not particularly ethical ones— working on behalf of a client who never hired them and would prefer they stop talking: evolution itself (and every other science rejected by creationists).

Now, stay with me here.

Evolution (and I will focus on that since it is my forte) is guilty. Guilty as sin. The evidence against it is overwhelming.  There’s the testimony of the rocks (my apologies to Hugh Miller 1802-1856) i.e. the fossil record, genetics, comparative anatomy, comparative embryology, systematics, biogeography. Every witness for the prosecution points the same way and delivers the same verdict:

Guilty beyond a reasonable doubt — of being the best scientific explanation for the change and diversification of life on Earth through time.

Enter the defense: the creationist attorneys.

They’ll argue almost anything —no matter how absurd or misleading— to get evolution off the hook. They endlessly try to poke superficial holes in the insurmountable evidence again their unwilling client.

They argue that we should ignore the smoking gun of reliable forensic evidence against evolution in favor of hearsay testimonials in ancient texts that an “intelligent designer” (wink, wink) did it through some unknown and unknowable process, for reasons, and in a manner, known only to itself.

And they’ll denounce as “unfair” and “unjust” the scientific rules of evidence, such as a reliance on methodological naturalism, for disallowing their preferred theory of the “crime”, “God did it”, due to a lack of testability.

Sorry, creationist lawyers, only two explanations consistent with the evidence:

A) Evolution really did it.

B) Or God has gone to extraordinary lengths to stage a cosmic frame-up so perfect that mere mortals cannot hope to see through it. Is that the story you want to go with?

Of course, none of their machinations have a prayer of working on a jury of scientific peers, but this is not the true target of creationist lawyers, rather their rhetoric is aimed at two other groups. 1) Those unfamiliar with either the workings of science or the particulars of the evidence in question that they hope to sway to their cause and more importantly, 2) those that care not about science or the evidence, who are already convinced of evolutions innocence and wish to have their prejudices reinforced.

But in all seriousness, history has shown repeatedly that lawyers taking up the antievolution cause get things just as wrong as creationists from other backgrounds. If lawyers really had some special insight into this subject, then history should reflect that, it doesn’t.

My thanks to Wesley Elsberry for some comments and suggestions.

Answers in Genesis apparently didn’t like MY answers

So I’ve been blocked by the Answers in Genesis Facebook page. They’ve deleted my comments and those of the people who had responded to my comments (their fans), without warning or explanation. Not that I don’t know why they did it; censorship is the go-to tool of those who don’t have an argument, so they use what power they have to try and make the inconvenient questions—or answers—go away.

In this case they had posted a link to an article on their website with the tagline:

Atheists believe that religion should be kept out of public places. But what if atheistic humanism is a religion, too?

Now I generally don’t get involved in theist vs. atheist debates online and I had no intent in doing so in my response to this tagline. All I did was state that I thought most atheists did not believe “that religion should be kept out of public places”, just out of governmental institutions like public schools and courtrooms etc. 

There was a little back and forth with some of the faithful, however I participated in no name calling or insult slinging. My harshest comment was probably when I suggested—after essentially being told that if I didn’t like their interpretation of church/state separation that I should move to a communist country, which is funny given that I am an anticommunist—that if they didn’t like living in a pluralistic liberal (small L) constitutional democratic republic where the rights of everyone were protected, they were free to leave.

There was that and I believe I referred to one of my interlocutors caricature of evolution as “ludicrous” or something similar. That was about it, that is all it took for the ban hammer to come down.

Pathetic really.

Ah well another feather in the cap to go along with my banning from the Institute for Creation Research’s Facebook page.   

 

Just say NO kids…

Marriage Equality at last!

I cannot let this wonderful historic day go unremarked upon here on PCwP. The Supreme Court of the United States has ruled in favor of marriage equality for all Americans straight or gay! Good on the SCOTUS majority! Well done! Here is a link to their official decision in the Obergefell v. Hodges case.

As for the SCOTUS minority, congratulations, you will go down in history as those on the wrong side of the fight for freedom, equality, and humanity.

Happy Lincoln & Darwin Day!

The Emancipator and the Evolutionizer, together again!!!

Happy Lincoln & Darwin Day everyone!!!

Lincol_Darwin_day - Copy

Chick-Fil-A Promo (Parody) from Mr. Deity

See also the latest Mr. Deity episode “Mr. Deity & The Marriage“, funny stuff!

Chick-fil-A-hole News

Just ran across this headline on the blog of flamingly homophobic Rick Pearcey:

200,000-Plus Chick-Fil-A Fans Sign Up to Protect Marriage, “Eat Mor Chicken”

Eating “mor” Chick-fil-A-hole chicken will “protect marriage” just as much as much as same sex marriage threatens the institution of marriage…

Not at all.

Chick-fil-A-hole Nuggets, now with Santorum sauce!

 

Another Pharyngula podcast with yours truly

The first part was on intelligent design creationists latest attacks on some of the genetic evidence for human evolution. The second was a ostensibly on humanism but strayed into issues surrounding the internecine warfare going on in the skeptic/atheist community over issues of feminism (which I will not touch with a light-year long pole) and progressive politics. Being of a slightly libertarian bent, I bit my tongue and let the anti-libertarian jibs go by (I am used to being casually libeled and slandered by my liberal Democrat friends).

Penn Jillette on the President and our stupid drug laws

Preach it brother Penn!

He’s absolutely right on this. What is the point of imprisoning people for using marijuana? Is it supposed to be for their own good? To protect them from themselves? The most chronic (no pun intended) user of marijuana might not be very productive but that is about the worst you can say about them. The majority of marijuana smokers are productive members of society, that is unless they get busted and imprisoned. Once that happens they’re convicted felons who will be a lot less likely to get a decent job.

“Sorry, we had to ruin your life to keep you from ruining your life.”

???

As far as health effects, sure if you are a very regular user you might risk long term diseases like those tobacco smokers face but I’ve yet to hear of a marijuana smoker who smoked a fraction of what tobacco smokers do (not counting those who smoke both). How many two pack a day weed smokers are there out there? That would be around 40 joints a day! And it is essentially impossible to overdose on marijuana. If you aren’t operating a motor vehicle or heavy machinery, the only way you could kill yourself with weed is to get enough to build a bonfire and jump into the middle of it.

On the other hand with alcohol, which is legal, one need not get into a car to die. Just hop on down down to the local liqueur store, buy yourself, say a 1.5 liter bottle of your favorite hard stuff (I prefer tequila), guzzle it within an hour or so and say hello to alcohol poisoning!

You wanna talk societal effects? How many violent crimes do you think get committed under the influence of  alcohol vs. marijuana? I bet they aren’t even in the same galaxy. Yes there is violent crime associated with marijuana on the trafficking end but that is due to the fact that it is illegal (the same was true of alcohol during prohibition).

There is no rational reason why marijuana is illegal while alcohol is legal and the fact that it is, is part of our national insanity.

/rant…

[Hat tip to Ed Brayton]

Pay no attention to the creationists behind the ID curtain!

Dr. Barbara Forrest of Southeastern Louisiana University (AKA “Evil, evil woman“), who testified to devastating effect during the 2005 intelligent design trial, Kitzmiller v. Dover (Pennsylvania), has written a scathing expose of the recent shenanigans that intelligent design proponents have been up to in Louisiana (and Tennessee) which I highly recommend you read.  It seems that once again the ID proponents are having difficulty keeping their creationist petticoats from showing.

I’m shocked! Shocked, I tell you!

See: Discovery Institute to LA Family Forum: “Repeat after me: ‘The LA Science Education Act is *NOT* a creationism law.’”